Pet House Rules

[Tbora]

Okay I was thinking the rules for pets (contructs and summons) are a bit clunky, as Fate does not really allow for specialization as far as that goes (But then very few systems make it fluid.) I was wondering, if someone could help me brainstorm some house rules that makes it easier to do as to make characters Binder not just playable, but viable.IE something to make contruct creation and demon summoning less demanding then it is in the current system.

[finnmckool]

I don't think you need house rules, just spend a bunch of points on refinement and upgrade a real big focus or the like to give you that extra boost to control more critters. between that and aspects you should be able to hit "epics" with a bit of work and that's the goal no matter your mancy.

[Tbora]

I disagree, while I think that works fine for most things, not really for the construct summoning/binding, atleast that is what I have seen with what I have played IRL.

[finnmckool]

really? where does the mechanical trouble for you lie? because a really souped up focus can get you quite the boost, like a +3 or more, if you really dump all your might into it. add into that the perfect binding agent (hair, name, etc) and you should be able to clear fairly medium hurdles reliably, in theory.

I'm asking because I'm still figuring this game out my ownself.

[Tbora]

The trouble for me is summoning greater constructs like Sue the Dinosaur.Unless your REALLY lucky it pretty much can't be done by a PC.Which doesn't really make sense to me as Dresden raised Sue pretty quickly witout much prep work at all.And to me, the rules should follow canon.

[CMEast]

Totally true Tbora, but I'd imagine a GM would rule Sue to be a plot device due to it's power. Still I know what you mean about the rules for summoning and constructs, they are a little vague and there aren't really any good examples, it's really more for NPC's I think which is a shame as it'd be nice for characters to have familiars.

Still I suppose they could simply be seen as extensions of the player (aspects, skills, stunts and powers; using the familiar as flavour to justify them) or they could take up enchanted item slots with some house rules perhaps?

[Mal_Luck]

May not be exactly what you are looking for, but in the Hawaii game my GM, KOFFEYKID. came up with the Subordinate "stunts."

Subordinate: You may stat out a second character, this is a subordinate of yours, and is loyal to you unto death (consider it your own character). He may only have 3 refresh worth of stunts, and 15 skill points with a skill cap of Good (+3). His or Her High Concept must relate to you.

Advanced Subordinate: When you select this stunt, you may advance your subordinate by 3 refresh, and allot him or her 9 more skill points with a skill cap of Great (+4), you must use one of your aspects to describe your relationship with this subordinate.

I keep trying to get him to bump advanced up to 10 additional skill points instead of nine (25 is easier to work with than 24). And we know that these are stronger than a typical stunt, we just call them stunts so the pure mortals can use it.

We at one point had three people that were going to use the stunts: millionaire and bodyguard, cop and partner, surfer and literal dog.

If your talking literal pet, may I suggest using Deadmanwalking's thread. He has over 50 animals made, most things appropriate for a "pet" is toward the front pages.

[Tbora]

I was thinking more along the lines of a summoner character who is like Binder except instead of lots of weaker minions (and summoning enmass presents troubles on its own.) generally summons a more badass demon that wipes the floor with his enemies.

[luminos]

There are all kinds of ways to deal with familiars/pets using the game system in place, but there isn't going to be a standardized way to do it because the method you use will vary by the type of flavor you want.  

Examples of different ways to handle pets/familiars:
- A stunt, using normal stunt rules with pets as the flavor ex. Wolf Companion (Survival) - You have befriended a wolf that is faithful to you and follows your orders.  When your wolf companion is with you, use survival instead of weapons for attacking.
- Summoning, without binding.  You then use a social conflict to convince the summoned creature to help you in the way you want.
- Summoning + Binding.  Use this if you want to have control over the creature you summon.  Because of the way the turn economy works, this method is extremely powerful, and the high complexity needed is justified.
- Plot Device.  This is how I'd handle Sue.  Harry getting the word of Kemmler and consulting Lash about it gives the GM justification for giving Harry this nifty one time use help.

And more, which I'm sure I'll think of later.

[Tbora]

Again that works for some things, but not for others.

I am thinking of a character that brings about 10-15 refresh contructs demons.

EDIT: And does so regulary (though not multiple ones at the same time,)

[Deadmanwalking]

Uh...Summoning Sue is about a 5 shift effect, Binding her more like 8, assuming she didn't mind being bound (which, as an animal spirit, seems likely). And acquiring a drum is almost certainly a Declaration, as is getting a drummer. Toss on an FP or two and Harry can do this easily. Why is this so hard again?

Now Binding something like Sue long-term (or if it's willing to go to the wall to resist you) is much harder (like, Complexity 25+)...but so? You can get Complexity that high in an evening with a bit of legitimate effort.

[luminos]

Again that works for some things, but not for others.

I am thinking of a character that brings about 10-15 refresh contructs demons.

EDIT: And does so regulary (though not multiple ones at the same time,)

I guess I just don't understand the problem.  This is difficult, but not prohibitively so.  A Thaumaturgist with lots of focus items for complexity in summoning/binding won't have a problem with it.

[CMEast]

This isn't quite what you're looking for, but you could create a character that regularly summons a demon to possess him using the Modular Abilities trapping and Beast change.

[+1] Human form
[-2] Ritual
[-1] Beast Change
[-7] Modular Abilities

This gives you the ability to cast powerful rituals as you can have a high conviction, lore and discipline but still take advantage of supernatural abilities like strength and speed by changing your skills when you beast change. Just pick a few 'demons' that you commonly change in to i.e. speedy winged demon, powerful bull-like demon and regenerating lizard-demon and you're set. Of course you don't have to cast a ritual to turn with this, but you could possibly get a +2 on human form if you have to create a ritual first in order to change.

Alternatively you could make the change an innate ability rather than a magical rite, allowing you to drop ritual and beast change which will give you more points to spend on supernatural powers, add beast change if you want to change skills up. It's not a pet but it could be a pretty powerful PC.

If you definitely want to summon the demons as separate creatures to yourself, I'd advise getting sponsored magic so that a) you can cast it at evocation speeds and b) you can summon more power by putting yourself in debt to your sponsor.

[finnmckool]

  A Thaumaturgist with lots of focus items for complexity in summoning/binding won't have a problem with it.

Or all the focus item slots upgraded into one uber item. burn 4 refinements for focus item slots and that's a +4 easy to one thing. (is that right?)

[luminos]

No, actually, all you need is one refinement for a focused practicioner, none for a sorcerer/wizard.  You'll have four focus items that way, and get the +4 to complexity.  And if you are a sorcerer/wizard, you can spend extra refresh to go higher with specializations.  Still, -3 refresh for ritual (Summoning/Binding) and a refinement is dead cheap to get a guy who can perform up to 9 complexity summoning/bindings on the fly.  A small handful of tagged aspects, and you can just about guarantee you have the power you need to get a pretty powerful demon working for you.