DFRPG as a Supers Game (renamed, split topic)

[luminos]

High Concept: Batman
Trouble: Becoming the Mask
Other Aspects: Criminals Killed my Parents, The Dark Knight, Bruce Wayne is a superficial playboy, The Batman Gambit, Loads of Gadgets

Skills:
Fantastic (+6):  Resources (Although his wealth is likely epic, or even legendary, it operates on an effective level of fantastic so that the people he works for have a harder time discovering that Bruce Wayne is Batman.  In a direct contest of resources, assume that he beats you)
Superb (+5): Stealth, Fists, Alertness
Great (+4): Discipline, Deceit, Empathy, Athletics
Good (+3): Driving, Endurance, Intimidation, Contacts, Investigation
The rest of his skills default to fair or average

Stunts:
Lush Lifestyle
High Quality Workspace x4
Martial Artist
Lethal Weapon
Armed Arts (Various bat gadgets)
Acrobat
On My Toes
Paranoid? Probably
Never Surprised
Too Fast to Hit
Ear to the Ground
Pilot
Rule With Fear (modified to just be against criminals, so give it a +1 to intimidation when used this way)
Hidden Menace
Quick Eye
Swift and Silent
Perfect Ambush
Fade Out

Refresh: -19 (pure mortal)

He own a lab and a workshop equal to his resources skill, and a library that is specifically for researching crimal and law enforcement topics of superb quality.  His employees and friends and what not use these workspaces to make him all kinds of useful gadgets, including full body armor that counts as armor:3, various projectiles, a state of the art armored vehicle, gadgets that act as stunts (grappling hook gives him an advanced version of spider walk, for example), and other things.  His stunts and skills give him everything he needs to be a scary, sneaky fighter.  But the one thing that truly makes him powerful, and a threat against his enemies, is that the guy who plays him is meta-gamer of the highest caliber.  This is why Batman will always just happen to have the exact countermeasures in place that he needs to get an advantage over even the most powerful opponents.  And whats worse, the GM can't do anything about it, because all these details are casually added in by Batman's player long before he has to use them, so its perfectly acceptable role-playing.

[exploding_brain]

You know, this system works surprisingly well for modeling some superheroes.  Probably need to up the maximum refresh rate, and use Lore to stand in for some kinds of super-science.  For instance:

The Incredible Hulk (built on 60 skill points, 20 refresh. Hey, this guy is considered a peer of Thor, god of freaking thunder.)

Dr. Bruce Banner

High Concept: Brilliant Scientist, trying to unlock the full potential of the human body
Trouble: Anger and pain release the unstoppable monster within

Other aspects:
"Please, don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry."
"HULK SMASH!"
Hunted by the Military
In love with Betty Ross (both of us)
The secrets of Gamma Radiation

Bruce Skills (60 pts):
Fantastic +6: Lore, Scholarship,
Superb +5: Craftsmanship, Investigation
Great +4: Conviction, Discipline,
Good +3: Alertness, Burglary, Deceit, Empathy, Rapport
Fair +2: Athletics, Endurance, Fists, Stealth, Survival,
Average +1: Contacts, Driving, Guns, Intimidate, Resources,

Hulk Skills (60 pts):
Fantastic +7: Endurance, Might,
Epic +6: Athletics, Fists
Superb +5: Conviction, Weapons
Great +4: Alertness, Intimidate
Good +3: Empathy, Stealth,
Fair +2: Discipline, Presence, Survival,
Average 1: Craftsmanship, Lore, Rapport, Scholarship,

Mortal Stunts:
Scholarship:
    Doctor (Radiotherapist)
    Scientist (Physics, Bio-physics)
Lore:
    Occultist (Gamma radiation, physical enhancement properties of)

Supernatural Powers

Shapeshifting
Beast Change [-1]
Human Form (involuntary change) [+2] affecting:
Hulking Size [-2]
Monstrous speed [-1] +2 bonus to alertness for initiative, can travel hundreds of miles at great speed, can travel up to 3 zones as a supplemental action
Mythic Strength [-6]
Mythic Toughness [-6]
Supernatural Recovery [-4]
Limitation, must revert to human form, usually unconscious, to begin recovery [+1]
The Catch [+2] Gamma Radiation related effects can overcome the supernatural toughness.  Gamma radiation related effects or emotion calming effects may be able to force reversion to human form.

Refresh -18

[iago]

Yeah, DFRPG does handle a few flavors of supers, albeit in a "back-end" way. I'd make a large number of tweaks to the system if I wanted to support straight up comic bookery, though.

[exploding_brain]

This originally grew out of an idea for a wizard who was a huge comic book fan.  Belief is power right?  So if the characters in the comics have a real hold on his imagination, that effects his magic.  He pictures himself as The Hulk, he can perform earth magic to smash down a wall or open a crack in the earth.  He pictures himself as Superman, he can us fire magic (heat vision).  Swap out Cyclops for spirit/force instead.  If he pictures himself as wolverine, he can use biomancy to heal.  Spiderman's webs become a water evocation block/grapple.  Mostly just imagery/flavor at that point.

Then he became a shapeshifter with True Shapeshifting and Modular Abilities.  Kind of a post-modern version of

(click to show/hide)

Listens to Wind.

The alternate skill shuffles and modular powers worked out so nicely than the idea kind of hijacked my brain.

[exploding_brain]

Squint a little bit to at the powers-cost-refresh mechanic, and it changes from a "free-will-vs-nature" theme to a "With great power comes great responsibility" theme.

Also, the solution to the Karin Murphy/Harry Dresden problem also solves the Batman/Superman problem.

[Drachasor]

You know, this system works surprisingly well for modeling some superheroes.  Probably need to up the maximum refresh rate, and use Lore to stand in for some kinds of super-science.  For instance:

Strength and Toughness effects probably need to go higher for Superheroes.  It's rather hard to use a car as a weapon in the rules and the Hulk/Superman could use things larger than a bus if they wanted.  I think two more levels of Strength and Toughness would do the job -- speed and recovery are probably about right, however.

Of course, one could argue this is a problem with Superhero settings.  The strength and toughness variations are insane.

[Belial666]

My own version of The Incredible Hulk has an effective Might score of 22 for lifting/breaking and Weapon 15 attacks. He could peel a vault door with as much effort as we would a sticky note and use a 100-ton train engine for a weapon. A light, one-handed weapon. It didn't need changing the system. Just upping the Refresh to senior-council level to fit all the powers.

Might +6, Mythic Strength +12, Mighty Thews/Bend and Break +2, Demonic Copilot (rage spirit) +1, True Might (as true aim) +1 = 22
Mighty Blows (modeled as weapon 4 at might+2 as Incite Emotion equilavent), Lethal Weapon +2 vs Unarmored, Dual Blows +50% (as per dual wield), Mythic Might +6 = 15



So you don't actually need to change the system to build something whose punches are battleship fire equivalents or who can lift 6000 tons or so.

[TheMouse]

You can pretty simply get your character's strength to the point of throwing cars as weapons and their toughness to the point of being able to shrug off glancing blows from handguns. For my supers needs, that seems good enough.

[Drachasor]

My own version of The Incredible Hulk has an effective Might score of 22 for lifting/breaking and Weapon 15 attacks. He could peel a vault door with as much effort as we would a sticky note and use a 100-ton train engine for a weapon. A light, one-handed weapon. It didn't need changing the system. Just upping the Refresh to senior-council level to fit all the powers.

Might +6, Mythic Strength +12, Mighty Thews/Bend and Break +2, Demonic Copilot (rage spirit) +1, True Might (as true aim) +1 = 22
Mighty Blows (modeled as weapon 4 at might+2 as Incite Emotion equilavent), Lethal Weapon +2 vs Unarmored, Dual Blows +50% (as per dual wield), Mythic Might +6 = 15

So you don't actually need to change the system to build something whose punches are battleship fire equivalents or who can lift 6000 tons or so.

Hmm, the increase each step is no more than 50%.  So 22 would be about 292 tons.  That's better than I thought, I admit.

I don't think Dual Blows is really allowable as you have it though.  Weapon Stuns are BETTER than fist stunts since you don't always have a weapon.

[Belial666]

A light adult is 120 pounds or less. A heavy adult is 200 pounds or more. A motorcycle is 600 pounds or less. A light car is 1400 pounds. A medium car is 2600 pounds. So each step in might is double the weight, or very close.

As for the weapon stunt, the Hulk's attacks are weapons using Might, not just fists.


PS: add another +2 to might rolls from Hulking Size for a total of +24. If you want to max it with the system without any changes/homebrew powers, give him a base might of Legendary for a total of +26. That's enough to lift 96.000 tons without rolling and without spending Fate Points for extra effort - an aircraft carrier. I don't think any current superhero is stronger.