Fate question - Assessment vs Declaration

[GoldenH]

So I ran a pre-game scene, tonight. It was pretty alright. I will likely come up with a few questions as I run the game though.

We are new to fate, so the PC kept trying to ask 'do I see X?' so that he could use it as a way to bypass an obstacle. I suggested that he simply make a Declaration instead of an Assessment. Is this the right thing to do? Or should I not be a lazy GM and provide a way for them to get through? (Though that can be a bit pixelbitchin')

[Papa Gruff]

I'd say you should trust your guts when to allow a declaration over an assessment. A good rule of thumb is: "If it brings a cool or funny element to the scene, then let the player declare instead of assess."

When you feel that the declaration would take to much tension out of the scene and makes it to easy for the PCs, then let them assess.

An example would be that your PC want to enter a guarded building secretly and are looking for a sneak in. You shouldn't allow a declare like: "My PC sees an open window on the ground floor and enters through it." That would be a pretty difficult assessment in my opinion because it would make the scene to easy. On the other hand a declaration of some guards that are distracted over the ongoing TV football game I would totally allow...

I hope i could help ...
Gruff   

[Wordmaker]

If the players are dead set on finding a way around a challenge rather than facing it, put it on them to come up with a way to do it. If they want the establish something you haven't thought of, then it's a declaration.

I agree with Papa Gruff that such declarations shouldn't be to just let the players find open and unguarded windows or something similar. That sort of thing robs a scene of its drama and tension, and really, this game is all about the drama and tension of facing danger to do the right thing. It's not about the players figuring out how to get around challenges or outsmart the GM. Players and GM alike should be working together to make the game as varied and entertaining as possible.

Remember you're totally within your right to refuse a declaration or an assessment (or just set the difficulty very high) if the player is asking for something that isn't there or isn't appopriate to the scene.

[Papa Gruff]

I just want to clarify something Wordmaker said. Technically you can't refuse the players to make assessments. You can just make it really difficult for them to state something. Actually funny situations can come of a failed assessment. The example of the rulebook is a pretty good one:

When the player tries to assess that he can enter the building through an air condition exhaust vent, but fails his assessment then the PC still might think it possible to enter, only to find his way blocked by an speeding ventilator that might chop him to peaces if doesn't come up with something fast... Funny and dramatic! Win win situation for you and your group.

[Wordmaker]

Ah, good catch.  Sorry about that.

[GoldenH]

Well the thing is that, rather than coming up with a solution to an obstacle and having the players try and guess what it is (which can cause pixelbitching), I think declaring would be more fun since it lets the players be creative. Of course, I could have an idea of how I'd get through it (and share that if they try assessments) but by the rules that is more useful for preperation rather than in action.

So I'm not really worried about if the players are abusing it but more if I'm having badwrongfun and there's a better way to do it in the game. Like should I let them investigate things without it being an assesment?

[Wordmaker]

I wouldn't sweat it so much. You're absolutely right, nothing's worse for a game than play stalling because the players can't guess what you've planned.

I'd suggest developing a particular scene with enough detail to give you an idea of how things might go, and then wing it. Declarations are an amazing part of this system and you should definitely encourage your players to use them.

[GoldenH]

Well I'm less stressing out and more trying to find out exactly what tools I got in this here tacklebox of FATE.

[Kordeth]

We are new to fate, so the PC kept trying to ask 'do I see X?' so that he could use it as a way to bypass an obstacle. I suggested that he simply make a Declaration instead of an Assessment. Is this the right thing to do? Or should I not be a lazy GM and provide a way for them to get through? (Though that can be a bit pixelbitchin')

It's absolutely the correct thing to do - although to keep things flowing, my usual response to that will either be "Yes, you do" (if it's a feature I've already established as being true for the scene or if it just makes sense to be there) or "I don't know - do you?" thus prompting the player to make a declaration.

Also remember that he doesn't necessarily have to make an assessment to find out stuff about the scene. Guessing Aspects is a perfectly sound and valid option.