What's the most munchkin character you can build?

[luminos]

its not twice the benefit, he has a total of +8 from his stacked cacth to aply to all his thoughness powers.

he also has +3 from his cheasy human form that affects his recovey/toughness.

so recovery/toughness is -4 +3 from human form  for -1
Invulnerability is -8 +8 for -1

Then this is where the problem is.  You don't get a +3 from human form.  You get a +2 from it the way you have it written, and if you really get attacked with lethal force, I kind of doubt shape-changing will happen fast enough to change you dieing.

[Falar]

Yeah, you'd only get +0 probably from Human Form.

Immunity to Weapons: -3 (Active at all times)
Toughness/Recovery against all but Obsidian: (-1)

Since the Toughness/Recovery are now -1, you don't gain ANYTHING for human form from them. Because if it's a -1 power, that's the lowest that you can pay for it. You can't get points back for a -1 power because you have a non-powered human form that is rarely and involuntarily triggered.

[Moriden]

nope, the base catch is applied to his recovery/toughness, then he has the second catch of "it only applies to weapons" which is nearly identical to the example one of "The Catch is that it only applies to attacks with fire." [pg 187 your story] in the example the fire elemental is vulnerable to cold, and its immunity only works on fire, this character is vulnerable to obsidian and its immunity only works on "weapons".

As it is, you're using a Stacked Catch on the same power. You can't do that. You have the Stacked Catch that only applies to Physical Immunity, which would get you +2 Not Weapons, +2 Easily Found (I hit you with a chair), +1 Research required. You can't then take a regular catch on the same power for what you had. You get the regular catch on some other power. Otherwise you have two things you're weak to for the same power - +2 Not Weapons and +2 Obsidian, in which case you would only  take the higher of the two because it's the same Catch, not a different one.

Also i would not approve this character, weapons is obviously a munchkinish catch to take, but since the op asked for the most broken character you could make, this is what i came up with.

[Deadmanwalking]

Then this is where the problem is.  You don't get a +3 from human form

You're right!

Okay, that's an entirely different issue. Human Form maxes out at +2, look at Lycanthropes who are both involuntary and rare, and still at +2. Other than that it technically works. Still, that's -6 Refresh, not -5.

[Moriden]

Okay, that's an entirely different issue. Human Form maxes out at +2, look at Lycanthropes who are both involuntary and rare, and still at +2. Other than that it technically works. Still, that's -6 Refresh, not -5.

thankfully that doesn't significantly change the math.
we have +8 from the stacked catch that applies to all toughness powers. we only need 7 of it to bring invulnerability to 1. that leaves one more to apply to toughness/recovery.

we take +2 from human form and the extra one from the stacked catch to bring that -4 to -1

[Falar]

Actually, you'd only get +0 from Human Form because you've only got one point of power tied to it and you can't get more back from Human Form than one less than the point of power you've got in it. Now, if you tied the Physical Immunity to the Human Form, then you could get the +2. And then you'd be totally vulnerable to the bullet to your head in Human Form as that would be before the Special Form kicked in.

[Moriden]

Actually, you'd only get +0 from Human Form because you've only got one point of power tied to it and you can't get more back from Human Form than one less than the point of power you've got in it. Now, if you tied the Physical Immunity to the Human Form, then you could get the +2.

hes got 4 points of toughness/recovery tied to it, allowing the full +3. im gonna go out on a limb and say my formatting was vague...

[Deadmanwalking]

Actually, you'd only get +0 from Human Form because you've only got one point of power tied to it and you can't get more back from Human Form than one less than the point of power you've got in it. Now, if you tied the Physical Immunity to the Human Form, then you could get the +2.

That's...debatable. His Catch can reduce Toughness abilities in general...including Physical Immunity. As long as he's not applying it twice, the math and mechanics actually work out.

The character is pretty damn broken, but it does work. Of course, the first werewolf or Red Court Vampire who meets it will tear it to pieces (claws aren't a weapon), but it works.

[Moriden]

The character is pretty damn broken, but it does work. Of course, the first werewolf or Red Court Vampire who meets it will tear it to pieces (claws aren't a weapon), but it works.

It wasn't meant to be Balanced just to be be broken, and be an example of what shouldn't be allowed as the op asked for. 


Also i have edited the original to make the math more transparent.

[Mal_Luck]

Of course, the first werewolf or Red Court Vampire who meets it will tear it to pieces (claws aren't a weapon), but it works.

Technically, bullets aren't weapons either. Just ammunition. 

[Moriden]

Technically, bullets aren't weapons either. Just ammunition.  Wink

Depends on gm interpretation. but yes that could be a get around. also remember that hes freakishly good with fire magic and can make "fire shields" on top of his other ability's at a base 7 shifts of power.

[Falar]

Physical immunity -8 total immunity Weapons. total cost -1
Stacked catch:  Not a Weapon +2, Easy to come by +2, Can be researched +1,
 Catch Obsidian +2, Can be researched +1
        The base catch affects physical immunity and supernatural recovery.
Inhuman recovery -2 and Inhuman Toughness -2 Tied to human form  total cost -1
   catch Obsidian +2, Can be researched +1
Human form +3 (Whenever xxx is attacked with lethal force he involuntarily changes)+1 base, +1 involuntary, +1 rare, how often dose a person really try to kill you.. so that's rare right...right?.

I think if you changed it to:

Physical immunity -8 total immunity Weapons. Total cost -8
Stacked Catch:  Not a Weapon +2, Easy to come by +2, Can be researched +1 Total Cost +5
Inhuman recovery -2 and Inhuman Toughness -2 Tied to human form   total cost -4

The Catch Obsidian +2, Can be researched +1 Total Cost +3

Human form +2 (Whenever xxx is attacked with lethal force he involuntarily changes)+1 base, +1 involuntary/rare

Then it would be a lot more clear. I still have the feeling you're getting a double +2 from the Recovery/Toughness and the Human Form, but it's more of an Iago question. I get the uneasy feeling (especially given my character of a similar nature), that when you use Human Form, you can't split a set of powers across both sides. It's either all of this type on one side, or all of this type on the other side. I'm fairly sure that's not definitely in the rules anywhere.

[Moriden]

edited. hopefully its less confusing now.

[Falar]

Yeah, the edit is clearer, but it still seems to say that the Recovery is -1, when it's actually -3. Unless you edited it again between the one while I was posting the previous post and when you said edited.

Darn fast moving threads.

Also, I'm pretty sure this character is exactly who Ebenezer is around to deal with. Blackstaff would pwn him.

[Deadmanwalking]

Item of Power     total cost -1
Staff of Death   +2 for being a walking stick sized staff. , Feeding dependency +1 , must use fire to "consume" living flesh
Channeling fire  -2   2 focus item slots are used on the staff itself for +1 to Offensive fire power,+1 to Control: Fire
Refinement -2         +2 focus item slots[ for another +2 offensive fire power], +1 Control Fire, +1 Power Fire

Looking it over, this...doesn't quite work. Since you have only Channeling you can't get Refinement except for Item Slots. So, 6 Focus Item Slots total. Which isn't enough for all the bonuses you list (especially when they all need to be assigned to either offense or defense). If you assign 4 to Off. Power and 2 to Off. Control you're good for the Rotes listed...but you need a Focus Item other than the staff since you lack Lore 6. Also his defensive magic'll be at about 3 Shifts.

Alternately (for slightly more brokenness) you could instead get Evocation and have your one Refinement be in Specialization (for a total of +2 Power, +1 Control with Fire) though you'd then only have 2 Focus Item Slots (for +2 Off. Power). That'll still all fit in the staff, and his defense will be at 5 shifts, but his offense will drop from 8 to 7.

In short, you somewhat overstate the magic you can achieve with -1 Refresh even with the drawbacks. 7 shift defenses? Not with any offense to speak of you don't.