Shadow Magic

[surarrin]

So, I am making a Minor Talent who has Cloak of Shadows as his minor power.

I want to develop him towards the magic end of the spectrum with Shadow (as an element) as his focus. Now a few ( one in particular) are crying foul over using an 'element' that isn't one of the classics.

One of the main points of contention is that I want to use Thaumaturgy to make an enchanted item that when thrown, and hits a targets shadow traps them for a small duration of time, but they're saying that this is impossible mechanically.

I'd like to get some opinions on either side of the arguements for these.

I've argued that it's mainly fluff, and that hitting someone, or hitting their shadow means they're still going to have to dodge, but it's fallen on deaf ears. Can any of you help?

[KOFFEYKID]

You should use spirit as the element behind this. Its the one that is used with photomancy, can create and manipulate light, bend light and create shadows (by pulling light away from an area).

[Deadmanwalking]

Why couldn't you trap them by hitting their Shadow? It's a Block action as per normal that they dodge as per normal, the rest is just flavor.

And alternate element structures are explicitly allowed, Shadow seems a reasonable one, particularly for a Focused Practicioner.

[surarrin]

You should use spirit as the element behind this. Its the one that is used with photomancy, can create and manipulate light, bend light and create shadows (by pulling light away from an area).

I was working with spirit as the baseline for the magic, but apparently that wasn't enough. :s

I hadn't considered photomancy, it vaguely fits, but doesn't completely mesh with the idea I had in mind.

Why couldn't you trap them by hitting their Shadow? It's a Block action as per normal that they dodge as per normal, the rest is just flavor.

And alternate element structures are explicitly allowed, Shadow seems a reasonable one, particularly for a Focused Practicioner.

I've argued that it's just fluff tacted on, but they refuse to accept it because "There is a huge mechanical difference."

[Deadmanwalking]

See p. 253 for the sidebar explicitly allowing non-standard Elements.

[luminos]

I've argued that it's just fluff tacted on, but they refuse to accept it because "There is a huge mechanical difference."

How the heck is it a mechanical difference? 

[Papa Gruff]

You should use spirit as the element behind this. Its the one that is used with photomancy, can create and manipulate light, bend light and create shadows (by pulling light away from an area).

I concur. Spirit seems to be the element that should be used here.

As to your item. I don't see why that shouldn't be possible in some way or another. Creating such an Item is certainly covered by the ruls. When you have the Enchanted Item Slots to create it you could design an apropriate effekt. Your Item might capture the shadow by use of spirit magic and impose a termporary aspect on your target: SHADOW TRAPPED. I would have to look at the details some more but I'm sure that such an item is possible.

[Deadmanwalking]

I've argued that it's just fluff tacted on, but they refuse to accept it because "There is a huge mechanical difference."

I'm with Luminos. What huge mechanical difference? Do they use a different skill to defend? Because that's actually allowed (see the sample spells section and look at the spells, half of them use something other than Athletics as a defense).

[surarrin]

I'm with Luminos. What huge mechanical difference? Do they use a different skill to defend? Because that's actually allowed (see the sample spells section and look at the spells, half of them use something other than Athletics as a defense).

I'd see it as using Athletics to dodge, or a counterspell. The only advantage would be the first use when they don't expect a dagger to the shadow to have an effect on them, but that might be enough to get a No. :s Once it hit's it'd be subject to a conflict to determine how long it holds for (max being 30 seconds), and that's open to a variety of counters (might, Discipline, Conviction)

[flymolo]

My suggestion write up the rotes you want with no fluff.  Get them approved, then ask for the shadow trappings.  Anything weird that you don't think the mechanics covers had with aspects.

Take an aspect like "Unexpected shadowy techniques" which you can invoke to use said techniques, but they can tag as being wise to your ways.

[surarrin]

So, everyone agrees with me so far.

I'd give my left foot for Iago to come along and put in his two cents. 

[mrsleep]

Oh, come on.  That's not fair.  The poor guy is only getting thirteen minutes of sleep per day as is.

[Nudge]

The poor guy is only getting thirteen minutes of sleep per day as is.

It's a rule. Can't have more than thirteen...

[drnuncheon]

Personally, I think it sounds like a great idea - both the shadow magic and trapping someone by hitting their shadow (which is really just a special effect).  There's definitely precedent for something similar in the series - Nicodemus Archleone - so I'm not sure why your group thinks this is so out of line.

[surarrin]

Personally, I think it sounds like a great idea - both the shadow magic and trapping someone by hitting their shadow (which is really just a special effect).  There's definitely precedent for something similar in the series - Nicodemus Archleone - so I'm not sure why your group thinks this is so out of line.

Because according to them Nicodemus is hacking reality with his Fallen Angel, and that no one without just as much power and knowledge could do anything similar. :s