Some Guidelines for Thaumaturgical Shapeshifting?

[Wyrdrune]

I have to admit, sometimes it is not easy to see the FATE solution of such things. the DFRPG is my first FATE game (have played a lot of d20 games, SR in all 4 editions and DnD in all 4 editions (though do not really like the 4th), and old WoD, especially mage).

[Biff Dyskolos]

(Demonic Co-Pilot would work too?).
Thats another Refresh (Total of 5) or 2 Shifts of Power. = Complexity of 11

In the context of shapeshifting Thaumaturgy, I would say that Demonic Co-Pilot is right out of the question.

1) there are already Thaumaturgy rules for containing, summoning and binding. Your system would just bypass them for the cost of a 2 shifts.

2) Demonic Co-Pilot requires you to have an aspect which can be compelled to represent the demon's agenda. Changing your aspects is outside the scope of Thaumaturgy.

[Korwin]

In the context of shapeshifting Thaumaturgy, I would say that Demonic Co-Pilot is right out of the question.

Mechanical I'm not seeing how Demonic Co-Pilot helps you master your new body, anyway.

[JustinS]

Mechanical I'm not seeing how Demonic Co-Pilot helps you master your new body, anyway.

Mechanically, it stops people from being able to use assessment actions to 'discover' that you have no idea how to use the body you have...

If you want one as part of ritual magic, summon one and let it posess you...

[kjpowers]

So, I have a more focused thematic question. To make it all make sense, I'll give a quick rundown of the character, Ted Richardson, who was at one time, one of the few Hedge Wizards working for the Venatori Umbrorum. A former Apprentice Wizard of the White Council, he enlisted in the U.S. Army in WWII before he could test for membership in the council (a convenient excuse - he never liked that wizards were more concerned with their own well-being than that of mortals, the perpetual food of the supernatural world). Following service in WWII with the elite Devil's Brigade and, later, service in Korea with the 8th Army Rangers, Ted had to leave the service because his still-strong magical power was beginning to make it impossible to be around 1950's army technology.

Ted took back up his magical study, though his 15 years or so away from complex magic made gaining a full scope of thaumaturgy impossible. So he instead developed as a Hedge Wizard (not a lawbreaking sorcerer) with strong evocation skills and a rituals: biomancy specialization. As part of his story, Ted was blacklisted after hunted down and killed a dozen ghouls that were preying on people in the Tenderloin district of San Francisco. The rest of the clan declared a vendetta against Ted, and he's been forced into a sort of witness protection program by the Venatori.

Okay, long question, I know, but I've had this idea that the main way Ted has been able to stay alive, but still working for the Venatori, is by using the biomancy to mimic the forms of other people. Not as a disguise for spying purposes, at least not normally, but because he has to live under an assumed identity. Would the biomancy specialization work for this, or should I just throw down and buy the "Mimic Form? I mean, he's really not a combat shapeshifter, and a lot of the talk on this thread has been centered around that aspect of shapeshifting.

Given that I've only had the pdfs for a week (they're awesome) and I've never played pen-and-paper rpgs, I'm trying to take this all in as best I can. The threads on this forum are excellent, and everyone seems to be so helpful, I felt like this was the time to go from stalker to poster. I'd appreciate any help folks can give.

Regards,

Kev

 

[Deadmanwalking]

How often does he (and can he) switch identities? And does it provide him any advantages other than looking different?

If it's once a year or less, and no real advantages, then I'd rule a specialty in Biomancy Complexity is more than enough. It's a big ritual to do it, but he only needs to do it every so often.

If he can do it at the drop of a hat, with 5 minutes of prep-time then he needs Mimic Form.

[kjpowers]

Yeah, it's more like the 5 minutes situation. He can put on his assumed identity like you or I might put on a suit before work, and it would take him about as long. Okay, "mimic form" it is. And, strictly speaking, I like the idea of him being a strong evocation spellslinger with almost no Thaumaturgy skills; it makes him vulnerable. God characters are no fun.

Thanks for the response, Deadmanwalking.

[Deadmanwalking]

No problem, I'm happy to help. 

[Korwin]

Okay, long question, I know, but I've had this idea that the main way Ted has been able to stay alive, but still working for the Venatori, is by using the biomancy to mimic the forms of other people. Not as a disguise for spying purposes, at least not normally, but because he has to live under an assumed identity. Would the biomancy specialization work for this, or should I just throw down and buy the "Mimic Form? I mean, he's really not a combat shapeshifter, and a lot of the talk on this thread has been centered around that aspect of shapeshifting.

If you want a disguise, then Illusions are an option as an alternate way to disguise.
You could take instead of Ritual a reflavored Glamour (into Illusion Spezialist).
(I imagine Molly with this...)

[SaintAndSinner]

Expanded Version of Fleshmask would also fit.

[Biff Dyskolos]

Okay, long question, I know, but I've had this idea that the main way Ted has been able to stay alive, but still working for the Venatori, is by using the biomancy to mimic the forms of other people. Not as a disguise for spying purposes, at least not normally, but because he has to live under an assumed identity. Would the biomancy specialization work for this, or should I just throw down and buy the "Mimic Form? I mean, he's really not a combat shapeshifter, and a lot of the talk on this thread has been centered around that aspect of shapeshifting.

If this guy's shapeshifting in not a tactical thing and more of a plot device thing then maybe you don't even need a power. You could just make a declaration, maybe spend a FATE point, at the beginning of each session describing your new identity. What ever ritual you perform to make the change only happens between session. If your cover gets blow during a session then your only option is to run.

This makes your shapeshifting more of a plot device than a power.

EDIT: I neglected to say that they would have to take an aspect for this "ritual". I was thinking it but I didn't say it.

[Deadmanwalking]

If this guy's shapeshifting in not a tactical thing and more of a plot device thing then maybe you don't even need a power. You could just make a declaration, maybe spend a FATE point, at the beginning of each session describing your new identity. What ever ritual you perform to make the change only happens between session. If your cover gets blow during a session then your only option is to run.

This makes your shapeshifting more of a plot device than a power.

I disagree, and stand by the distinction I made previously (if there's prep-time and materials required, it's a ritual, if you can do it in 5 minutes, it's a power).

[Biff Dyskolos]

I disagree, and stand by the distinction I made previously (if there's prep-time and materials required, it's a ritual, if you can do it in 5 minutes, it's a power).

If the "ritual" can only be performed between sessions then does the prep and casting times would not be an issue, right?

My reasoning was that it would be somewhat similar to enchanted items. There is some kind of ritual used to recharge them between sessions but we don't really care what it is because the only important thing is that you only start each session with x number of uses of each item/potion slot.

If the only benefit of this shape shifting ritual is that they start each session with a new identity then the ritual isn't all that important.

[Moriden]

I disagree, and stand by the distinction I made previously (if there's prep-time and materials required, it's a ritual, if you can do it in 5 minutes, it's a power).

And iether way it can be one. both niether, or something wierder ic. the names of the powers on your sheat do not need to reflect what you think you do ic.

[Deadmanwalking]

If the "ritual" can only be performed between sessions then does the prep and casting times would not be an issue, right?

My reasoning was that it would be somewhat similar to enchanted items. There is some kind of ritual used to recharge them between sessions but we don't really care what it is because the only important thing is that you only start each session with x number of uses of each item/potion slot.

If the only benefit of this shape shifting ritual is that they start each session with a new identity then the ritual isn't all that important.

Sure. You could even build it that way if you wanted, but he specifically said he wanted the character to be able to do it "as easily as changing clothes." That right there is a power.