Magic Measurment Systems that a reader can buy

[Lanodantheon]

In writing my current project, a story of a young man discovering he's a magic user, I'm pretty good to go. I've had few hiccups, but they have been countered by dozens of pages of notes and research. The one problem I had with my Main Character has since been solved with some help on this very board (http://www.jimbutcheronline.com/bb/index.php/topic,11175.0.html) =.

Well I have another hiccup that could use some outside opinions from unafraid forum readers, lurkers and trolls: My magic system

There have been several threads already about magic systems, one of which pointed me toward a very helpful article: http://www.brandonsanderson.com/article/40/Sandersons-First-Law   But, none of those threads solve my problem.

My magic system is a variant on a familiar formula, a simplistic, hard magic that tends to follow physics with a Drain Mechanic.
I don't claim my system to be completely original.
The Drain Mechanic is similar to the one found in many RPGs: You use magic and it drains you, makes you tired. Every Wizard has a "Gas Tank" as my protagonist calls it, a collection of energy that they can draw on safely representing the magic around them, the energy they themselves can generate and so on. After a certain point of casting, the tank runs out and to get more energy, the Wizard's body breaks itself down for energy.  When the body of the caster breaks itself down for energy, it goes for calories first, then fat, then muscles, then everything else(Leading to Necrosis, the flesh dying). You can also overchannel and get cooked in my system, but necrosis is the bigger threat.

I designed it this way so that at the climax of a drawn out Wizard's Battle, my MC would be beyond exhaustion and desperate to win as he watches his limbs start to turn black.

But to personalize this system further I wanted to add one more element, Measurement.

One of the things RPGs have always had was Mana/MP, an exact measurement of how much magic the caster had left. In a system like mine where a caster can literally destroy his/herself if he's not careful, an accurate system of magical measurement would be essential. However, if I have my characters talking about MP all the time, then congratulations I have just written SquareSoft JRPG: The Novel. I'm not talking about something like that.

Look at it like this: Scientists today measure everything around them. We measure electricity in Wattage, Voltage, Amperage and Resistence in Ohms. We measure gravitational forces of the earth in Newtons, pounds per square inch, etc. Why can't Wizards have their own magical measurement system? The answer is they can.

The actual questions I have are listed neatly thus:

1. How can I implement this system believably, if at all? It's my opinion that as long as it is established early and shown to be consistent, then it can work.

2. If Casters had this Magic Gas Tank (measured in MP for the sake of argument), how would the Wizard keep track of it?  Using you gut and saying "It feels like I have 15 MP left" is the literary way, but I want a visual way. I want my Casters to have an external visual and accurate way to track their reserves. I was thinking of maybe an ouraboras tattoo that is divided into sections that changes color, but I think that may be too derivative. Any other ideas are appreciated. (If you were a Wizard, how would you keep track?)

3. If there are units of Magical Measurement, what do they use as a measurement? My one base line is the idea of a Cantrip, the most basic spell, being exactly one Magical Unit and everything else is based on that.

4. , What's the Magical unit called?  I'm terrible with names, so my first try to name it was in Merls (As in Merlin). My logic being that famous Wizards have units named after them like famous scientists.

I'm pretty much good to go with this stuff, I just need an insanity/stupidity check of my work.

[ballplayer72]

Well it depends on what kind of magic you throw around. 



First off, are there types of magic?  Can anyone do all of them?  What are the rules that you are going to have to work around?

Would this "counter" (thing that visually represents how high or low on gas you are) need to be installed (as in artificial) or does it show up with your mojo?   Does each practicioner have a different sign?   Perhaps you could use zodiac symbols, or something like that that glow different colors or fade in and out, something like that?

[knnn]

Some thoughts:

1.  They have this little thing for batteries where you press on it, and it colors depending on how much charge you have left.   There are also a very simple pressure gauge for tires.  Have the wizard hold a lightbulb in his hand and see how bright he can make it.

2.  I'm not a biologist, but I seem to recall that the energy of the body generally comes from burning sugars.  There's a very simple way to measure blood-sugar level (people with diabetes  do it all the time), so maybe drip a bit of blood on some scale.

3.  Look at Calories.  Pretty much everything you eat has numbers on the side.  There are also guidelines for the amount of calories each type of activity uses up.  You can keep track, but there's no real way to know for sure how much you currently have.  (Maybe spells have been more carefully measured?)

4.  If the wizardry you have is an exact science, then I would expect more than "light spell==1 mp".  More likely that at one point the scholars perfected Magic-to-Energy conversion rules (maybe even E=Magic*C^2), in which case, your basic unit of energy would something along of "The amount of Magic to heat up a Liter of water by one degree", or somesuch. 

Oh, and the chance that a spell takes an exact whole amount of MP to cast should be the same chance that a human being is *exactly* a whole number of inches tall (close to zero).

5.  Units:

Thaum: (as in Thaumaturgy - from discworld)
QuasitPower: (equivalent to horsepower) -  The amount of magic a quasit can produce in a second.


Take a look here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unusual_units_of_measurement

[Mana Sin]

 Perhaps to check the magic you can have the wizards use watches? Like... Imagine an older wizard, like a Dumbledore, or Blackstaff pulling out an antique pocket watch and checking their magic gauges. It's a pretty cool imagine in my mind, it would serve to infuriate their enemies due the gesture being rather nonchalant. The measure for the magic will be shown just like a clock face mixed with a pie chart, if that makes any sense, with each 'second' counting for one magic point for beginning mages. As the wizards grow in power, their watches will automatically update to use new units/intervals, like say B-Staff would have his intervals of 100, so 12 to 5 would count as 500 magic points. Some watches have a little window on the clock face that show the date and such, on the magic watch these can tell the exact number of points remaining over the total like a fraction. The watch can glow (to show the general percentage left) but only when the owner focuses on it, to keep the light from hindering their stealth efforts (if there are any). Of course, it can simply be a wristwatch, if that's what the wizard prefers - imagine some rich wizard with his being in the form of a Rolex, hah.

 This can also lead to some jokes on how the watches are useful for keeping a wizard from accidentally killing himself, but can never tell time. Though, I suppose you can keep the hands on to tell time, while using the 'glow' to tell the percentage, and rely on the numbers in the fraction for specifics. I don't think this concept has been done before, but if so... Tell me where?  I never heard of it before, but hey... There's 6 billion+ humans in the world..

 As for a measure for the magic, how about something like 'ticks' if you're gonna work the watch angle? If not, MUM, Magic Units (per) Mage sounds kinda funny. If you want latin, Magus refero, Mage/Magic echos (not sure if it's accurate). I'm not too great with names, heh.. I'm more of an idea sort of guy.

[belial.1980]

According to Sanderson's Law, it appears that you're using a pretty "hard" magic system. I like the body draining effect you've envisioned, especially the necrosis. Since calories and fat drain first after tapping out, you'd know that any chubby wizard you come aross is prudent with their reserves, lol.

Perhaps the wizards have a tattoo that corresponds to the physical/metaphical state of their body. Maybe a heart that drains or fades as the power reduces, or maybe something more complicated, similar to the tribal pattern tattoos that Susan has that lose or change color. Perhaps the tattoo is a tree, person, or animal that changes, withers, or acts like its in pain as the power drains. This might be a bit too nebulous though, as it looks like you're going for something more concrete, like a gas gauge.

Another idea I had was a glowing orb, akin to a Will O' The Wisp that the wizard could summon. It changes colors, fades, gets smaller, or somehow changes as the power level gets low.

How about a homunculus or familiar that's assigned to the character? It could be a character in itself if you wanted, or it could be just a simple plot device, that doesn't actually have a personality, but just keeps track of the wizard's power level. I kind of like the idea of said familiar changing from its normal shape to a vulture  (carrion eater) or owl (symbol of death in many cultures) when the wizard's drained.

How overt did you want this to be? Is this something that another person could easily see? It  could be very disadvantageous for another wizard to be able to note how much juice their rival has left. Another suggestion I had is that the wizard checks their power level by closing their eyes and seeing the guage, almost like they're looking inside themselves. However, if magic is something that can be measured in units then I imagine it'd be pretty easy to sense how much a wizard has left in their reserves.

Anyway, just some stuff to chew on. Good luck!








 

[Elanith]

As belial said, depending on how overt this measuring system is, it could be very disadvantageous.  If there is a lot of wizard duals or wars going on, an entire science could be made into creating devices that are hidden or provide incorrect information to others that could see it.  Do they have to be calibrated to specific wizards, or can anyone use them?

That being said i think your big question you need to answer is; WHY did these people come up with a way to determine how much power, exactly, they have left?  From what you have described already, it sounds like each individual wizard has a way already of at least eyeballing how much power they have, as the more they use, the more tired they get and at sever enough levels begin suffering obvious physical injuries.

Have you thought about making it so they couldn't determine how much power they have?  Perhaps as they use their power, it causes a natural high, either endorphins or just raw energy being converted from fat/muscle which makes them feel good.  This could prevent a wizard from knowing just how close he is to causing himself physical harm( no longer feel fatigue or drawing enough power just an immunity to pain), and would spark a need for some way to keep track of your power, especially for newbie wizards who are not yet accustomed to their limitations yet.

[Quantus]

There are a few things: 

Is the unit an absolute scale?  by that I mean does the same light spell cost 1 mp no matter who is casting or is it more subjective?  Is the measurement in terms of power percentage or again an absolute scale? 

No matter what you do, DO NOT USE REAL UNITS (Calories etc) or you will lose your audience the first time you try to throw fire or something and they realize that the math doesnt work out.  Unless you want to check the math on every thing your characters do, id just avoid it.

If you want the scale to be something physical (ie watch, tatoo, etc) then how do all the wizards acquire them, and what are the consequences of not having one. 



What I would suggest is something that is a natural/necessary part of using the magic.  Like make them require a primary focus (staff, athame, crystal pendent, etc directly linked to your power) that behaves differently depending on how much energy you are using or what source (normal, fat, necrofying bodily tissue etc) but something that cannot be avoided because of the nature of the magic itself.  The effect would be a natural thing, and then the caster could perhaps shape their focus to be more measurable (like if it makes your staff glow, and you carve the runes in it in such a way that the effect travels incrementally up its length rather than teh more natural brightness growing in less measurable intensity.


One example I can think of was from the Exalted RP system.  The way it worked for the main race (solar) was that they all had essence (mana) to drive their powers, and they were used in the units of motes (mp).  The catch was taht the more they used, the more they started to glow, making it obvious that they were one of the reviled solar.  The moer they used the bigger and brighter their aura became, until they went full super-saiyan.  Another race did the same, but they were elemental based and became more elementally aspected the more they used. 

[belial.1980]

What about blood sacrifices? Can a wizard take the life of something else to avoid draining his or her own reserves? (Seems like something the villainous characters would do) How could that translate?

I think you risk taking some of the mystery and mystique from magic if you quantify it so absolutely. That being said though, how about taking that idea and running with it? What if mystics and scientists have quantified just about everything, like love or the soul? An angel is nothing but a specific frequency range of spiritual energy? Don't know if that works out with what you had in mind, but I think that could be an interesting concept.

Either way, I suggest doing some research on John Dee. He was a famous magician who lived at the turn of the 17th century, that beleived science, magic, and philosophy were all pure forms of study, equally viable in their own right.

 

[Quantus]

Either way, I suggest doing some research on John Dee. He was a famous magician who lived at the turn of the 17th century, that beleived science, magic, and philosophy were all pure forms of study, equally viable in their own right.

Also check out Rudolf Steiner and the Anthroposophy movement which attempted to apply "the scientific method to phenomena of human soul-life and to spiritual experiences."

[Lanodantheon]

After going over these responses, I've decided to wing it and first and see if I can get it to work.

My MC is mostly self-taught so if I want the Measurement system to appear, it can appear slowly as he learns more about it.

[MrWolfwood]

Depending on the setting, here are a few ideas!

1. If steam or cyberpunk-ish  consider a literal magic counter, like a pressure gauge. However, it does present the "I just read an rpg discussion forum" response from the reader.

2. A full body tattoo that slowly disappears as the caster's pool is drained. Good for ritual magic, and the tattoo could also be representative of important things to the caster. Might also consider at lowerr power levels, the wizard merely has a sleeve or backpiece, and more powerful magi might not have any more room to spare.

3. Opposite the above, a series of markings appear as power is expended.

4. Plain old physical effects would also work. Yeah, throwing seven fireballs might be tiring, but using a force-ram to knockdown a two-story would feel more like running the New York marathon.

5. Scanners, dbz style. Over 9000!!!

(sorry about 5, couldn't resist

[thausgt]

Depending on the setting, here are a few ideas!

1. If steam or cyberpunk-ish  consider a literal magic counter, like a pressure gauge. However, it does present the "I just read an rpg discussion forum" response from the reader.

This idea suggests an opportunity to do some research. Modern medicine has access to all kinds of medical sensors and whatnot to determine the patient's health by various measures: blood pressure, electrocardiogram, respiratory efficiency, etc. You might want to do some research to see what the average patient can buy/rent to wear for constant monitoring. This should result in some ideas of what the "magic-energy monitoring unit" is actually scanning. And don't forget to include different levels of quality: "That top-of-the-line unit gives me accuracy down to four decimal points. Your cheap piece of crap has an error rate of around three percentage points. Are you sure you want to gamble your magic and your life on something that prone to failure?"

2. A full body tattoo that slowly disappears as the caster's pool is drained. Good for ritual magic, and the tattoo could also be representative of important things to the caster. Might also consider at lowerr power levels, the wizard merely has a sleeve or backpiece, and more powerful magi might not have any more room to spare.

3. Opposite the above, a series of markings appear as power is expended.

Both of these ideas seem interesting, and which one a magic user chooses could say a lot about the magic user in question. One whose tatto fades during combat could figure out a way to keep enemies from seeing it, in order to run bluffs. One whose tattoo appears probably values accuracy over combat efficiency (a researcher, for example, who is usually not under attack while casting magic).

4. Plain old physical effects would also work. Yeah, throwing seven fireballs might be tiring, but using a force-ram to knockdown a two-story would feel more like running the New York marathon.

That implies that magic is based on the same system that fuels physical activities: the balance between blood sugar and fatigue toxin levels in the blood. It also gives you a wonderful magical MacGuffin: a spell or artifact that directly converts fatigue toxins into blood sugar. Every magic user in your world would be after such a gimmick. Some would want to use it in order to fuel spells that they couldn't handle otherwise, the rest to destroy it so the magic users don't burn themselves out, probably violently.

5. Scanners, dbz style. Over 9000!!!

(sorry about 5, couldn't resist

If you hadn't tossed it in, someone else would. One of the greaterst advantages one side can have in a fight is the capacity to not only monitor one's own magic levels, but to analyze the threat presented by any opponents to the greatest degree of accuracy possible. And one of the greatest defenses against such scans is to either A) decieve the scanner or B) keep the attacker from using it.

[The Corvidian]

Do they have tools? If they do, have it where their magical tools tell them how much power they have.

[Lanodantheon]

Do they have tools? If they do, have it where their magical tools tell them how much power they have.

Yes, they have tools. They have many tools. They without a doubt will be one of the ways to keep track.
One of the slated classes on the docket (it is a school drama after all) is Magical Theory, Craftsmanship and Formula Design aka Magecraft. Magecraft is all about how to use magic. Wands, staves, gloves, pens, cards, and I gotta hand one "That Guy" with the audacity to use Sock Puppets for Sonomancy.

At this point though, I've kind of decided that the exact measurement thing is an "Advanced Topic". In a first time novel like this is, a detailed discussion of magical units would bog down the narrative something awful. The MC will only have enough understanding of the systems involved to be able to say, "That's bad isn't it?"

[The Corvidian]

You could also throw in the idea of batteries.